OK first up - This is my blog, I can write what I like and if you don't like it - erm tough. This is a long post covering a number of gripes I have at the moment which are better put here than in guild chat.
Next - the whole 25 v 10 man raid discussions following Blizzards announced changes for Cataclysm. I've read a lot and heard everyones point of view. But what seems to have been omitted from a lot of the discussions is that 25 man raiding is NOT harder than 10 man raiding. In fact in my opinion 25 man raiding is often easier than 10 man raiding - so getting better gear in 25 man raids just sucks up to the GS e-peens who seem to forget that recount now shows a DPS/GS ratio which finally shows how fail a great number of players really are.
Lets summarise: GS DOES NOT EQUAL SKILL! Got that? Good.
"So where is all this coming from Breevok?" I hear you ask.
Well you probably know that my GM (and RL partner) has her own blog Dwarf Babble. And therefore you know about some of the pressures she faces on a daily basis to keep everyone happy. You also know that we are not running 25 man ICC.
There have been a few events of recent times that have caused ongoing 'e-peening'.
Event One - a guildie who 'disconnected' usually after a wipe, never to return. After the 5th time he was told "until you net connection sorts out you won't get a spot in the ICC runs".
So now that guildie will run 25 man ICC with some other guild (funnily enough with no internet issues) and link every piece of gear that drops, retell the stories of his glorious healing on this boss or that, and generally just tell us all how l33t he is.
Do you want to know what? I don't fucking care. If the people you are running with are so wonderful, please close the door behind you when you gquit.
Event Two - last night the guild went and visited orgrimmar for no other reason than we could. The event has been in the calendar for a while but there was an ICC 10 continuation scheduled for afterwards. All damn evening we get "Is the ICC run continuing?" "I turned down a 25 man ICC run because I thought we were continuing"
Again I dont fucking care - YOU chose not to go on the 25 man run, NOT ME. Your choice, live with it. And yes its nice to know I dont have short term memory issues, I remember what you said the first time.
And if you had gone to the ICC run - you would have been replaced - we replaced a tank (who did go and do a 25 man run - and got lots of gear and is a very happy man)
And if ICC 25 is the be all and end all, please read the forums and the blogs - WE ALL PUG 25 ICC,there are regular runs of some (some run with Infinity, others with Glitch) I do the GKP runs, others just pug.
So let me explain why 25 man content is easier than 10 man.
The only difficult thing about 25 man content is the fact that you have to organise 25 people - and generally at least two or three of them are people you wouldnt share a passing pleasantry in real life with, yet you spend 4 hours raiding WoW content with them.
What isnt important with 25 man runs is one persona dying. In fact you often do bosses with 24 people, sometimes 22 or 23. You can carry several people in ICC 25. This cannot be said for ICC 10.
For example - Saurfang. One common technique used in 25 man is just letting the first two marks die. You Let Them Die - because you do not need them to beat the boss. They are just making up numbers. And it doesnt matter who they are - healer or DPS.- they are just sacrificed. They are, in fact, worthless.
Try doing that in 10 man. If you lose one person you are unlikely to be successful.
10 mans are always going to be harder - you just don't have the slack in the make up of the raid. Two tanks, 2 healers, one healer/dps, 5 DPS. Thats it. No choice.
Everyone has to get out of the fire, everyone has to give 90%+.
I admit that the first three bosses are catwalks - you can carry a couple, but not saurfang - blood beasts have to die and die quickly. Marks cause wipes and you need to be at 40% health before the first mark otherwise you are screwed. DPS has to be high, healing on the button, tanks in unison. Its a 'raider check' not a 'gear check' - alas in 25 man the same isn't true.
Of course there are elements of boss fights that are added in 25 man content - mind control in Deathwhisper etc, but this is done to try and mask the fact that 25 man content is not as difficult as some people would have you believe.
Another thing about 10 man content is generally that is where people learn bosses - 25 is purely to get gear. Dying in a 10 man run means you are back there 5 minutes later to try again - progressing with each attempt. Dying in 25 man content means you get rezzed at the end of the fight, get to roll on the loot and learn far less.
In summary - anyone that tells you that 25 man content is where its at, most likely didnt do 40 man raids - which by all accounts really were the pinacle of WoW raiding. They are just e-peens who think having 6k gearscore means that they are something special - if they were rich they would have red sports cars and still be masking the fact they have small appendages.
So for me Blizzards announcement over 25 v10 man gear just addresses an imbalance in the game. Kudos for them for not being naive enough to continue to pander to the needy.
The attack of the raiding guilds
Historically this always happens - you get towards the end of an expansion and players take breaks so they can return once the next expansion is released. These players are either burnt out, bored or have achieved everything they want to. They are not interested in achievements, or PvP or any other part of the game that would fill the next few months. So they leave.
Mostly these are players from raiding guilds - and thus the membership of these guilds dwindle. Obviously the members that remain still want to raid so they start recruiting.
You'll find in the next few months that it becomes easier and easier to find pugs to run 25 man content. And often if you are vaguely competent the raid leader will invite you to join their guild. Usually this is accompanied by ego-massaging, dissing of your current guild and other such attempts of basic manipulation to get you to join.
Whether you leave or stay is ultimately up to you. But I would urge you to consider your options.
The best DPS in my guild loves our guild. Yet when he pugs 25 man content he tops DPS charts over and over. This week the Raid Leader whispered him, asking him to join their guild. Yet my guildie knows that he loves our guild. He doesn't want to leave. So he politely declines and waits for the next invite a week later.
So what? Well the point is - my guildie tops the DPS charts of a raiding guild run - and HE'S NOT IN A RAIDING GUILD!
Having been in a raiding guild - they arent as wonderful as you think they are. Generally there is no one online until 15 minutes before raid start time. 15 minutes after the raid finishes there is no-one on. There are no giggles in /g, there is no going to Orgrimmar for shits and giggles. There are no 3D zergs of OS nor achievement runs through Molton Core. There is no one caring you just got Loremaster. They are sterile environments with no joy. Remember you pay to play - and that this is an MMO. That means interacting with people. If gear is all you care about, go play Sacred or some other standalone RPG - the result is similar to the raiding guild
Finally I need to apologise to a guildie - Imrahill.
He was the person that went to ICC 25 last night and got gear. I snarled at him at one stage after he linked some piece of gear and then announced he was off to Dreamwalker. I shouldn't have made mention that he reminded me of the guy from Event One above - and he took offence. And rightly so. Imrahill is a sweetheart and was just excited with all his new progressions. I am sorry I took that away from him.
However what he missed is the fact that all the '25 man ICC is easy' is a slap in the face for my GM. She's is running a guild because this is how the members want to run - we are slowly progressing towards 25 man content - so sometimes the 25 man preen just portrays 'how fail' the guild is to some people. It's not intentional on their part, but sometimes people need to think about what knock on affect their words, unintentionally, can have.
My GM puts her heart and soul into the guild. Event One has been an insult to her, and she's licking the wound its caused. Sometimes comments from others just poke at the injury and I, being her partner, reacts. I apologise to Immy once again, and look forward to him taking us the Dreamwalker in the near future.
Next - the whole 25 v 10 man raid discussions following Blizzards announced changes for Cataclysm. I've read a lot and heard everyones point of view. But what seems to have been omitted from a lot of the discussions is that 25 man raiding is NOT harder than 10 man raiding. In fact in my opinion 25 man raiding is often easier than 10 man raiding - so getting better gear in 25 man raids just sucks up to the GS e-peens who seem to forget that recount now shows a DPS/GS ratio which finally shows how fail a great number of players really are.
Lets summarise: GS DOES NOT EQUAL SKILL! Got that? Good.
"So where is all this coming from Breevok?" I hear you ask.
Well you probably know that my GM (and RL partner) has her own blog Dwarf Babble. And therefore you know about some of the pressures she faces on a daily basis to keep everyone happy. You also know that we are not running 25 man ICC.
There have been a few events of recent times that have caused ongoing 'e-peening'.
Event One - a guildie who 'disconnected' usually after a wipe, never to return. After the 5th time he was told "until you net connection sorts out you won't get a spot in the ICC runs".
So now that guildie will run 25 man ICC with some other guild (funnily enough with no internet issues) and link every piece of gear that drops, retell the stories of his glorious healing on this boss or that, and generally just tell us all how l33t he is.
Do you want to know what? I don't fucking care. If the people you are running with are so wonderful, please close the door behind you when you gquit.
Event Two - last night the guild went and visited orgrimmar for no other reason than we could. The event has been in the calendar for a while but there was an ICC 10 continuation scheduled for afterwards. All damn evening we get "Is the ICC run continuing?" "I turned down a 25 man ICC run because I thought we were continuing"
Again I dont fucking care - YOU chose not to go on the 25 man run, NOT ME. Your choice, live with it. And yes its nice to know I dont have short term memory issues, I remember what you said the first time.
And if you had gone to the ICC run - you would have been replaced - we replaced a tank (who did go and do a 25 man run - and got lots of gear and is a very happy man)
And if ICC 25 is the be all and end all, please read the forums and the blogs - WE ALL PUG 25 ICC,there are regular runs of some (some run with Infinity, others with Glitch) I do the GKP runs, others just pug.
So let me explain why 25 man content is easier than 10 man.
The only difficult thing about 25 man content is the fact that you have to organise 25 people - and generally at least two or three of them are people you wouldnt share a passing pleasantry in real life with, yet you spend 4 hours raiding WoW content with them.
What isnt important with 25 man runs is one persona dying. In fact you often do bosses with 24 people, sometimes 22 or 23. You can carry several people in ICC 25. This cannot be said for ICC 10.
For example - Saurfang. One common technique used in 25 man is just letting the first two marks die. You Let Them Die - because you do not need them to beat the boss. They are just making up numbers. And it doesnt matter who they are - healer or DPS.- they are just sacrificed. They are, in fact, worthless.
Try doing that in 10 man. If you lose one person you are unlikely to be successful.
10 mans are always going to be harder - you just don't have the slack in the make up of the raid. Two tanks, 2 healers, one healer/dps, 5 DPS. Thats it. No choice.
Everyone has to get out of the fire, everyone has to give 90%+.
I admit that the first three bosses are catwalks - you can carry a couple, but not saurfang - blood beasts have to die and die quickly. Marks cause wipes and you need to be at 40% health before the first mark otherwise you are screwed. DPS has to be high, healing on the button, tanks in unison. Its a 'raider check' not a 'gear check' - alas in 25 man the same isn't true.
Of course there are elements of boss fights that are added in 25 man content - mind control in Deathwhisper etc, but this is done to try and mask the fact that 25 man content is not as difficult as some people would have you believe.
Another thing about 10 man content is generally that is where people learn bosses - 25 is purely to get gear. Dying in a 10 man run means you are back there 5 minutes later to try again - progressing with each attempt. Dying in 25 man content means you get rezzed at the end of the fight, get to roll on the loot and learn far less.
In summary - anyone that tells you that 25 man content is where its at, most likely didnt do 40 man raids - which by all accounts really were the pinacle of WoW raiding. They are just e-peens who think having 6k gearscore means that they are something special - if they were rich they would have red sports cars and still be masking the fact they have small appendages.
So for me Blizzards announcement over 25 v10 man gear just addresses an imbalance in the game. Kudos for them for not being naive enough to continue to pander to the needy.
The attack of the raiding guilds
Historically this always happens - you get towards the end of an expansion and players take breaks so they can return once the next expansion is released. These players are either burnt out, bored or have achieved everything they want to. They are not interested in achievements, or PvP or any other part of the game that would fill the next few months. So they leave.
Mostly these are players from raiding guilds - and thus the membership of these guilds dwindle. Obviously the members that remain still want to raid so they start recruiting.
You'll find in the next few months that it becomes easier and easier to find pugs to run 25 man content. And often if you are vaguely competent the raid leader will invite you to join their guild. Usually this is accompanied by ego-massaging, dissing of your current guild and other such attempts of basic manipulation to get you to join.
Whether you leave or stay is ultimately up to you. But I would urge you to consider your options.
The best DPS in my guild loves our guild. Yet when he pugs 25 man content he tops DPS charts over and over. This week the Raid Leader whispered him, asking him to join their guild. Yet my guildie knows that he loves our guild. He doesn't want to leave. So he politely declines and waits for the next invite a week later.
So what? Well the point is - my guildie tops the DPS charts of a raiding guild run - and HE'S NOT IN A RAIDING GUILD!
Having been in a raiding guild - they arent as wonderful as you think they are. Generally there is no one online until 15 minutes before raid start time. 15 minutes after the raid finishes there is no-one on. There are no giggles in /g, there is no going to Orgrimmar for shits and giggles. There are no 3D zergs of OS nor achievement runs through Molton Core. There is no one caring you just got Loremaster. They are sterile environments with no joy. Remember you pay to play - and that this is an MMO. That means interacting with people. If gear is all you care about, go play Sacred or some other standalone RPG - the result is similar to the raiding guild
Finally I need to apologise to a guildie - Imrahill.
He was the person that went to ICC 25 last night and got gear. I snarled at him at one stage after he linked some piece of gear and then announced he was off to Dreamwalker. I shouldn't have made mention that he reminded me of the guy from Event One above - and he took offence. And rightly so. Imrahill is a sweetheart and was just excited with all his new progressions. I am sorry I took that away from him.
However what he missed is the fact that all the '25 man ICC is easy' is a slap in the face for my GM. She's is running a guild because this is how the members want to run - we are slowly progressing towards 25 man content - so sometimes the 25 man preen just portrays 'how fail' the guild is to some people. It's not intentional on their part, but sometimes people need to think about what knock on affect their words, unintentionally, can have.
My GM puts her heart and soul into the guild. Event One has been an insult to her, and she's licking the wound its caused. Sometimes comments from others just poke at the injury and I, being her partner, reacts. I apologise to Immy once again, and look forward to him taking us the Dreamwalker in the near future.
4 comments:
What has blizzard done about 10 vs 25 man loot? Could you link me something pls?
True words, thank you for that!
Based on my raiding experience, I completely agree with your statement that 25 man content is often easier than 10 man. The coordination to get 25 raiders together within a guild and getting them to show up is the hardest part of 25 man raiding. However, once you have the group together, there is a lot of room for error.
I also find it extremely rude for members to link the loot and accomplishments in guild chat when running with a raiding guild. There are a lot of negative aspects to a raiding guild running the "cool" content that most members of a smaller guild aren't looking for. Linking the cool loot doesn't give the full story. I've had to ask members in the past that if they have other characters in raiding guilds or if they are pugging, to keep it to themselves or in private chat with friends that they know are interested.
I like reading Dwarf Babble, and I can totally relate to the feeling of being slapped in the face when you put so much effort into keeping the guild raids running and keeping everyone happy. Keep up your good work, and try not to feel discouraged!
Klemon - this probably sums it up mate:
http://blue.mmo-champion.com/t/24401856405/cataclysm-raid-progression-refinements/
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