I woke this morning (Monday) to discover that the arrow market is a two horse race. Just me and my /ignore buddy. Now the fun really begins.
However that's now and there are events inbetween I've missed out. But I'll start this post with my confusion about things which makes little or no sense to me. This is a jotpad post as much as anything - just to warn you in advance
I have to admit I am rather bemused. The starting point is simple - arrows are made from crystallized shadow x2.
Sourcing these mats is the first point where my opponent and I differ
My opposition farms the mats. I buy them from the AH.
I pay 8g max for a eternal shadow - no farming for me. The AH supplys me 50-100 eternals a day at that price and I now have stocks to last through a very long price war, even if eternals skyrocket to outrageous prices (which they wont). Basically I am through the risk stage of this experiment - everything is paid for and now its just reinvesting part of the ongoing profit back into the materials.
The scond difference between us is that he makes and sells the arrows with a single toon whereas I have 'Breevok' selling mine.
It's important never to forget that 'Time is money, friend!'.
So when it comes to my and my opponent there are different time consideration
Him: Time to farm mat + Time to create arrows + Time to post arrows on the AH
Me: Time to buy mats + time to collect mats from mailbox and forward to engineer + Time to create arrows + Time to send to arrow seller + Time to post arrows on the AH
Looking just at the difference in the above equations:
Now I know that the mail system isnt that slow so I reckon I could add an extra 5seconds per sale to compensate for buying the eternals and sending the arrows to another toon.
To farm them you are either killing mobs in WG (best done when you hold WG - which the alliance only hold around 30% of the time on my server) or mining saronite deposits.
Now having never farmed - I would think that an efficient farmer using gatherer etc, should be able to farm 5 eternal shadows an hour? (I've love someone to give me a better idea if I am even close with this)
5 eternals cost me 40g max. 5 eternals cost me in time about 2 minutes in the extra time at the mailbox. So 40g for 58 minutes work comes out at 41g an hour.
Think about that for a moment - 41g an hour. I earnt more than that last night running Naxx to get my weekly done.
Why why why do people farm and think its 'for free'? Its the most inefficient use of their time other than being a /2 spammer. Running dailies will earn you 100g+ an hour.
I sincerely hope he's a miner - at least the saronite ore can be sold at 10g a stack as well (although he must sell that under a different toon)
I almost feel sorry for him.
Anyways back to events of the weekend - I've actually been away a lot of the time helping a friend with a charity weekend. I havent dropped my arrowprices below 2g70s a stack for much of the weekend, and this morning prices were back up to 4g90s.
My mind is split - do I just play the bounce up and down game with two players in the market? Or do I force him out entirely and then have cartblache on the market until the next street punk comes along.
The ease of making money here is mindblowing compared to glyphs - so much less detailed work. Providing you have bag space you can make 100 stacks of arrows and post them away in 10 minutes even with distractions.
Just to get ink for glyphs you have to get herbs, mill herbs (with its associated mouse click each time), then then you can make your inks.
The glyphs themselves require visits to two different retailers (albeit next to each other) to acquire the right inks and parchments - and this is after you've worked out the glyphs you need.
I know there are addons that help (QA3, Lil sparky etc) but ultimately its a pain in the ass to do and with the glyph market still locked down after 6 months of enforced low prices - I honestly wonder if the profits are worth the hassle.
Arrows are so much easier - one product produced from one material. The only drawback with arrows is storage - but thats what the mailbox is for.
Its seems too easy - and that's what worries me - I managed to enter a market and make 2k profit (after set up costs of 3k) in a week. If I can do it then so can the next guy***
Anyways - the plan for the next phase.
I couldnt make a decision this morning what to do - so I posted 20 stacks just under my opponent, and another 20 stages significantly lower.
Funnily he logged on when I was online, posted under my first twenty and left my lower twenty un-cut.
I had the lower stacks posted at 2g90 a stack. At 8g an eternal, stacks are costing 1g60 to make. Even with AH fees thats 1g15 a stack or 43% profit. At 100 stacks a day, 7 days a week thats 800g a week for just holding the market.
If I allow the market up to say 4g70 a stacks (which is where I did my minor undercut) - I make 180% profit or around 2g85g a stack.
However that the higher price I get half the sales - the result being around a 1000g profit a week - and a competitior still in the market.
For 200g profit a week I think its worth keeping them low for a while.
But then keep thinking about the GG undercut model.
Gevlon uses the auctioneer undercut model - allowing the market price to dictate the posting price. He undercuts up to 40% below market price, and overcuts to a maximum of 20%. This means that a price way as has just taken place, happens more slowly - and even if someone disappears from the market, the market itself doesnt immediately spring back to top prices - which just attracts the competitors back in.
I'll consider the Gevlon model tonight and see what I think... too much work to do for real to get distracted with spreadsheets.
*** I love these jot pad posts - actually the next guy cant do what I did. I entered the market where two guys had let the prices drift up to over 7g a stack. Thats how I made 5k in a week. No one else can do that now because I have no intention of letting prices stay that high if there is a competitior around.
However that's now and there are events inbetween I've missed out. But I'll start this post with my confusion about things which makes little or no sense to me. This is a jotpad post as much as anything - just to warn you in advance
I have to admit I am rather bemused. The starting point is simple - arrows are made from crystallized shadow x2.
Sourcing these mats is the first point where my opponent and I differ
My opposition farms the mats. I buy them from the AH.
I pay 8g max for a eternal shadow - no farming for me. The AH supplys me 50-100 eternals a day at that price and I now have stocks to last through a very long price war, even if eternals skyrocket to outrageous prices (which they wont). Basically I am through the risk stage of this experiment - everything is paid for and now its just reinvesting part of the ongoing profit back into the materials.
The scond difference between us is that he makes and sells the arrows with a single toon whereas I have 'Breevok' selling mine.
It's important never to forget that 'Time is money, friend!'.
So when it comes to my and my opponent there are different time consideration
Him: Time to farm mat + Time to create arrows + Time to post arrows on the AH
Me: Time to buy mats + time to collect mats from mailbox and forward to engineer + Time to create arrows + Time to send to arrow seller + Time to post arrows on the AH
Looking just at the difference in the above equations:
Time to Farm Mats v Time to buy from AH and collect from mailbox + time to send to arrows seller
Now I know that the mail system isnt that slow so I reckon I could add an extra 5seconds per sale to compensate for buying the eternals and sending the arrows to another toon.
To farm them you are either killing mobs in WG (best done when you hold WG - which the alliance only hold around 30% of the time on my server) or mining saronite deposits.
Now having never farmed - I would think that an efficient farmer using gatherer etc, should be able to farm 5 eternal shadows an hour? (I've love someone to give me a better idea if I am even close with this)
5 eternals cost me 40g max. 5 eternals cost me in time about 2 minutes in the extra time at the mailbox. So 40g for 58 minutes work comes out at 41g an hour.
Think about that for a moment - 41g an hour. I earnt more than that last night running Naxx to get my weekly done.
Why why why do people farm and think its 'for free'? Its the most inefficient use of their time other than being a /2 spammer. Running dailies will earn you 100g+ an hour.
I sincerely hope he's a miner - at least the saronite ore can be sold at 10g a stack as well (although he must sell that under a different toon)
I almost feel sorry for him.
Anyways back to events of the weekend - I've actually been away a lot of the time helping a friend with a charity weekend. I havent dropped my arrowprices below 2g70s a stack for much of the weekend, and this morning prices were back up to 4g90s.
My mind is split - do I just play the bounce up and down game with two players in the market? Or do I force him out entirely and then have cartblache on the market until the next street punk comes along.
The ease of making money here is mindblowing compared to glyphs - so much less detailed work. Providing you have bag space you can make 100 stacks of arrows and post them away in 10 minutes even with distractions.
Just to get ink for glyphs you have to get herbs, mill herbs (with its associated mouse click each time), then then you can make your inks.
The glyphs themselves require visits to two different retailers (albeit next to each other) to acquire the right inks and parchments - and this is after you've worked out the glyphs you need.
I know there are addons that help (QA3, Lil sparky etc) but ultimately its a pain in the ass to do and with the glyph market still locked down after 6 months of enforced low prices - I honestly wonder if the profits are worth the hassle.
Arrows are so much easier - one product produced from one material. The only drawback with arrows is storage - but thats what the mailbox is for.
Its seems too easy - and that's what worries me - I managed to enter a market and make 2k profit (after set up costs of 3k) in a week. If I can do it then so can the next guy***
Anyways - the plan for the next phase.
I couldnt make a decision this morning what to do - so I posted 20 stacks just under my opponent, and another 20 stages significantly lower.
Funnily he logged on when I was online, posted under my first twenty and left my lower twenty un-cut.
I had the lower stacks posted at 2g90 a stack. At 8g an eternal, stacks are costing 1g60 to make. Even with AH fees thats 1g15 a stack or 43% profit. At 100 stacks a day, 7 days a week thats 800g a week for just holding the market.
If I allow the market up to say 4g70 a stacks (which is where I did my minor undercut) - I make 180% profit or around 2g85g a stack.
However that the higher price I get half the sales - the result being around a 1000g profit a week - and a competitior still in the market.
For 200g profit a week I think its worth keeping them low for a while.
But then keep thinking about the GG undercut model.
Gevlon uses the auctioneer undercut model - allowing the market price to dictate the posting price. He undercuts up to 40% below market price, and overcuts to a maximum of 20%. This means that a price way as has just taken place, happens more slowly - and even if someone disappears from the market, the market itself doesnt immediately spring back to top prices - which just attracts the competitors back in.
I'll consider the Gevlon model tonight and see what I think... too much work to do for real to get distracted with spreadsheets.
*** I love these jot pad posts - actually the next guy cant do what I did. I entered the market where two guys had let the prices drift up to over 7g a stack. Thats how I made 5k in a week. No one else can do that now because I have no intention of letting prices stay that high if there is a competitior around.
2 comments:
I disagree about inscription. Just yesterday I made 2000 gold from selling glyphs. Granted, that doesn't usually happen but I still sell them consistently enough and with sufficient automation to make it very worthwhile.
Aaaah but I doubt you have a gold seller in competition.
I have stocks of over 300 different types of glyphs.
Of these I post about 100 types a day - because I have a threhold price of 4g. Of these 100 glyph types posted rough figures: 60 posted at 4-5g range, 30 posted at 5-10g range, 10 posted at 10g+ range.
Sales are around 50 glyphs a day - making about 300g a day.
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